Remakes, Reboots and Localizations

[Jason Tandro]

What is your opinion on all these old horror series being rebooted and remade in the modern day?

I have a tough time dealing with sequel's unless a series is specifically planned as a duo, trilogy, etc. That being said some sequels have been phenomenally good. The Devil's Rejects is a much better film than House of 1000 Corpses. I thought Shrek 2 was funnier than Shrek. Ring 2 was just as good as Ring.

I am also generally against rebooting a series, but there have been a few exceptions. The new Star Trek movie, Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings, and a handful of others.

This all being said I have no problem with film localizations, though I acknowledge that the originals are generally better (although I have to say, I thought the American Ring was scarier. Still, the original had a much better story.)

[psychokind]

Jason Tandro wrote:

Ring 2 was just as good as Ring.

W T F?

the ring 2 sucked ass, the first was a really good horror movie (I'll admit it's my favorite, and the only one that scared me until now)

[SoulBlazerFan]

Jason Tandro wrote:

What is your opinion on all these old horror series being rebooted and remade in the modern day? I have a tough time dealing with sequel's unless a series is specifically planned as a duo, trilogy, etc. That being said some sequels have been phenomenally good. The Devil's Rejects is a much better film than House of 1000 Corpses. I thought Shrek 2 was funnier than Shrek. Ring 2 was just as good as Ring. I am also generally against rebooting a series, but there have been a few exceptions. The new Star Trek movie, Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings, and a handful of others. This all being said I have no problem with film localizations, though I acknowledge that the originals are generally better (although I have to say, I thought the American Ring was scarier. Still, the original had a much better story.)

Well... technically, neither of those you mentioned is a reboot. Since Old Spock appears in the new Trek (I guess that's spoiler?) it's actually a sequel... it takes place after the original series movies, and is merely a way to continue that story, albeit different.

Then, LoTR is a adaptation of the source material, and not necessarily a reboot, especially considering the earlier films weren't that good, and had a completed story.

That said, I hate reboots/remakes for the most part. Being the slasher film fan I am, I did see the new Friday the 13th, Halloween and Nightmare films.

Friday was a huge disappointment. Nightmare was feh, but I ended up hating it because they didn't try to be a better film, which they could have. They ended up staying with being "okay" and leaving it at that.

I enjoyed Halloween... up until the actual remake part of it. The first half with young Michael and his mother was really good story, showing how a boy becomes a monster through nuture as opposed to nature. Once it moved into the actual remake part- the film fell apart, because we had a half an hour left to cram an entire hour and half long story into. There's no character development, the choice for the lead was extremely disappointing. And the sequel- well, no use in discussing that, I'd rather believe it never happened.

Other movies do decidely need reboots. For instance, Texas Chainsaw was a perfect example. The franchise had been dead since "The New Beginning" in 1994, a terrible film. The remake ended up being pretty good, save the kind of silly ending. And then they did unnecessary prequel... which was ruined by one of the best parts of the first- R. Lee Ermey, who is best known for his portrayal of the Drill Sergeant in Full Metal Jacket. They had a healthy peppering of his crazy in the first Texas film, and it was great.

However, the prequel he was entirely overused, leading the focus away from Leatherface, the main villian of the story. You get lost watching it, because Leatherface is barely established in that film.

Other remakes have suffered similiar fates- Sorority Row, April Fools, My Bloody Valentine 3D.

Not to say all reboots are terrible. Let's not forget the Batman Reboot. While not horror, it definitely took the franchise in a much stronger direction than Joel Schumacher had going with his Arnold Schartzenegger Mr. Freeze, Bat-Nipples and unnecessary ass-shots.

As for localizations... there is a universal belief American audiences are morons. There is a perfect example with "Ghost In The Shell" and "Akira." Someone once said that other countries don't need everything over-explained, that they get the jist. Both of these films had left something to be desired for certain American audiences- because here, everything has to be explained to the final detail. That's why they shove the endings of the Saw films in our face- he "apparently" can't understand what was going on, so they have to overexplain it for us, down to the smallest detail.

I did enjoy those top two movies, and lost interest in the Saw franchise particularly because it lost its story, and did try and overexplain everything that one tiny shot could've explained.

I'll take another example... one of my all time favorite movies is called "Phantasm." At this point, there are four of them, the first made in 1979 and the last in 1999. They are at varying degrees of budget, but, because of the brilliant director, Don Coscarelli (Bubba-Ho-Tep, Beastmaster, Survival Quest) these films, no matter the budget, told a confusing and complex story that is never fully explained. The film leaves you with questions, and I find that's the difference between great directors and decent ones- the best ones can tell a story and leave you guessing. A lesser director would explain everything so you could "Understand" it.

The film was a hit here in America... but was a huge monster hit in other countries, especially Japan, which further goes to prove that a general populous of the American audiences "Just don't get it."

One final note- not every Japan made film is necessarily better than it's localization. When the original Gojira was released in Japan, it was a partial success. When it came to America, they introduced an American actor into it, reshot only a few scenes of the film, and released the minorly changed film as "Godzilla." It was a huge success over here, and then was sent back to Japan- where that version was a bigger success than it's original counterpart- and the only difference was the addition of the American actor.

Well, that was a lot longer than I had intended it to be. My bad if this ends up being tl;dr, but I feel very passionate about this wholw debate. I have very strong views on the issues... and above are only a few of them.

[tay120n64]

I only liked the first Shrek.

[Jason Tandro]

@SBF: No worries. It's been pretty well established that you are the movie guru on the forums.

[psychokind]

SoulBlazerFan wrote:

It was a huge success over here, and then was sent back to Japan- where that version was a bigger success than it's original counterpart- and the only difference was the addition of the American actor.

I have seen the death note movies, and they sucked ass because of the japanese actors. so to say, almost every movie with japanese actors I have seen was incredibly bad because of their acting

[SoulBlazerFan]

psychokind wrote:

SoulBlazerFan wrote: It was a huge success over here, and then was sent back to Japan- where that version was a bigger success than it's original counterpart- and the only difference was the addition of the American actor. I have seen the death note movies, and they sucked ass because of the japanese actors. so to say, almost every movie with japanese actors I have seen was incredibly bad because of their acting

I must assume you've never seen Battle Royale then...

[Blade]

Haven't seen many Japanese Movies that are not animes, but...Suicide Club was one of the worst movies I have EVER seen. It's hailed as an awesome masterpiece in the vain of Battle Royale (which I haven't seen).

On Topic, I can't contribute that much. Liked the LotR movies, although many die-hard fantasyfans disliked them. After all, remakes are a good chance to get into the whole subject, and discover ancient originals, and in the end, you find your optinion via your own taste.

[psychokind]

SoulBlazerFan wrote:

psychokind wrote: SoulBlazerFan wrote: It was a huge success over here, and then was sent back to Japan- where that version was a bigger success than it's original counterpart- and the only difference was the addition of the American actor. I have seen the death note movies, and they sucked ass because of the japanese actors. so to say, almost every movie with japanese actors I have seen was incredibly bad because of their acting I must assume you've never seen Battle Royale then...

I say "almost" every movie of course there are exceptions.

[inferiare]

Therevare some movies that don't need to be remade because the originals are better (Karate Kid comes to mind.)

[Miss Prime Blue]

inferiare wrote:

Therevare some movies that don't need to be remade because the originals are better (Karate Kid comes to mind.)

Yes, a thousand times yes.

Not to mention that there is no actual "karate" in that movie, the setting is in china and they practice Kung Fu, but besides that, yea.

Every time I hear someone say that the remake is "good", I want to barf all over them.

[Jason Tandro]

I never saw Karate Kid, and I'm not sorry for the loss. But all the original slasher flicks I haven't seen and while they may be campy, they're a huge part of American film culture, y'know?

I intend to rectify that.

[Blade]

I saw the Karate Kid trailer some time ago, and it was quite impressive, I must say.

The original Karate Kid dates WAY back in the 80's I think, and it looks like a fresh makeover, with Jackie Chan as Mr. Miyagi, who's quite an archaic person himself.

[tay120n64]

I have yet to hear anyone say they disliked the new Karate Kid.

Granted, the people who say its good are saying that out of context of the original.

[Mantaray]

SoulBlazerFan wrote:

Someone once said that other countries don't need everything over-explained, that they get the jist. Both of these films had left something to be desired for certain American audiences- because here, everything has to be explained to the final detail. That's why they shove the endings of the Saw films in our face- he "apparently" can't understand what was going on, so they have to overexplain it for us, down to the smallest detail.

A great example of this would the the Yu-Gi-Oh dub. Just listen, they talk your ears off.

I've always hated stuff like that. We can already assume what's going on without having to explain anything, yet they have to bottle everything down to make sure EVERYONE gets it (even blind people). It always baffled me when people didn't like movies like FF: Spirits Within just because it was apparently confusing, but you don't need to think much to sort of get what happened


the original karate kid was great. KK2 wasn't nearly as good (there was hardly any fighting at all... and he cheated on his gf O_O)

the new one looks worthwhile. i dont mind jackie chan being miyagi. let's see how well he does