White/ Straight Pride Parades?

[inferiare]

Jason Tandro wrote:

rainichan wrote: Jason Tandro wrote: Off-Topic: At this exact moment I am at exactly 5,000 Gems. And I am about break the beauty... so I wish to savor the moment... okay enough of that. Well Mr. Geneaology, you may have met your match, because us Mormons are pretty serious about our family history. Did you know that everyone on the planet is related within 40 or so generations? Everyone in Europe is related within I think 32 generations. My source is this article amongst other genealogical studies that I've come across in my family history studies. Essentially we're all the same. Purity of race is a bold-faced lie because we're simply too similar and too different in the same respect. Sorry to say, we're ALL related if you believe the story about Adam and Eve. Incest is best, essentially, and Adam and Eve = everyone's distant relatives. Therefore, we're all related by THAT. /lighthearted humor As a matter of fact I do believe the "story about Adam and Eve" but I believe that there is more to it than that. Not saying I know what that is, but simply saying that I think God deliberately kept some things out of our reach. Anyways best not to get off topic and steer in the direction of religion, which I have been vehemently trying to avoid.

I do too, of course. There had to be a way to populate the earth, and it all stemmed from them. So despite the crazy generational thing, all of our family trees lead back to them in the end, is what I think. Very, VERY distant family.

[Ratty Randnums]

Just found an article that illuminates this issue rather well - http://www.socialistalternative.org/news/article18.php?id=116
On the Stonewall Riots of 1969, why they happened. And the development of gay culture under sociatle and government oppression.

[Manibrandr System]

Interesting debate here, good points all 'round. However I must address this.

Jason Tandro wrote:

Now does this mean I think we should outlaw homosexuality? Of course not! While I may not approve, these people have the right to do as they wish without me interfering, but don't go saying "I can't choose it. It's how I am naturally. I was born this way." Sorry, but it is my firm believe that straight is God's default and THEN environmental factors may change what you are attracted to. And if you wanna go have sex with a person of the same sex then do it! Just accept the fact that when you choose to have sex with this person, you are still making a choice, as much as if I were to choose to have sex with a woman.

The thing is, there IS little say in deciding one's sexuality. There has been research done that suggests that factors like birth-order, hormone imbalance and genetics takes the lion's share of influencing one's sexual preferences. It is possible, however to be able to choose how one acts on those desires. Basically there is little to no way to choose what one would prefer sexually, but they are perfectly capable of performing sexual activities of their choosing.

[Jason Tandro]

Valerie Valens wrote:

Interesting debate here, good points all 'round. However I must address this. Jason Tandro wrote: Now does this mean I think we should outlaw homosexuality? Of course not! While I may not approve, these people have the right to do as they wish without me interfering, but don't go saying "I can't choose it. It's how I am naturally. I was born this way." Sorry, but it is my firm believe that straight is God's default and THEN environmental factors may change what you are attracted to. And if you wanna go have sex with a person of the same sex then do it! Just accept the fact that when you choose to have sex with this person, you are still making a choice, as much as if I were to choose to have sex with a woman. The thing is, there IS little say in deciding one's sexuality. There has been research done that suggests that factors like birth-order, hormone imbalance and genetics takes the lion's share of influencing one's sexual preferences. It is possible, however to be able to choose how one acts on those desires. Basically there is little to no way to choose what one would prefer sexually, but they are perfectly capable of performing sexual activities of their choosing.

Well yes, and that was my point exactly. I do not believe that we can choose attraction. If that were the case, I would choose not to be attracted to all the freaky things I'm into so I could fit into normal society. (Actually probably not. Freaks have more fun.)

But you can always choose action. And while we're on the subject, I would be interest in seeing you cite sources on this. Not because I think you're lying, I'm sure the studies have been done, I'm just interested in a scholarly sense.

Frankly, though, I've always considered genetics a soft-science (and this is coming from a genealogical wizard). Frankly having a clearly identifiable gay gene would probably serve to be a bad thing for you in the long run. While yes, it may prove a genetic link between human sexuality and predeterminations of birth, how many ignorant rednecks would start testing their unborn children for the gay gene?

Of course the solution to that problem is to make genetic testing on children illegal, and I have no problem with this, even if you end up having (as psychokind brought up in another thread) a sick child.

[Freedan]

Jason mentioning the idea of a 'gay gene' reminded me....

It seems science disagrees with the notion of homosexuality being biological.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=97940

A quick couple of quotes, if I may:

""There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles. ...""

"Although there is no mention of the research that influenced this new position statement, it is clear that efforts to 'prove' that homosexuality is simply a biological fait accompli have failed," Byrd wrote. "The activist researchers themselves have reluctantly reached that conclusion. There is no gay gene. There is no simple biological pathway to homosexuality." "

[EverPhoenix]

Freedan, the Dark Knight wrote:

Jason mentioning the idea of a 'gay gene' reminded me.... It seems science disagrees with the notion of homosexuality being biological. http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=97940 A quick couple of quotes, if I may: ""There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles. ..."" "Although there is no mention of the research that influenced this new position statement, it is clear that efforts to 'prove' that homosexuality is simply a biological fait accompli have failed," Byrd wrote. "The activist researchers themselves have reluctantly reached that conclusion. There is no gay gene. There is no simple biological pathway to homosexuality." "

i dont think its biological. its probably to do with the way the people are raised, by whom they are raised, and other circumstances.

[Jason Tandro]

I could kiss you, if that wasn't a little gay.

Yes, that illustrates my point quite nicely. Thanks!

[Freedan]

Jason Tandro wrote:

I could kiss you, if that wasn't a little gay.

A little? That exceeded the realm of "gay", and crossed in to the realm of "incredigay".

[Ratty Randnums]

And yet homosexuality remains a persistent phenomenon in nature/the animal kingdom, just as it has done since before man existed.
Since were linking to videos I've always found this one to be cute funny and informative.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYMjXucTFaM

I myself don't think it's down to a "gene" but is a lot more complex than that. I do think I have had homosexual, what's the best word? Attractions, since the begging of my own sexuality. It just took a few things for me to fully realize and** accept it.
(I could go into details but I doubt you'd care to hear about that.)

And just for fun- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPKH_XjY5aI

**Though I've never had anything against LGBTT persons, as I was always taught to be open minded.

[EverPhoenix]

after seeing bruno, i now almost feel sorry for homosexuals. what with having sascha baron cohen pulling that stunt on them (ie the movie, not anything in the movie)

[psychokind]

I remember the search for the gay-gene, there were many heated debates in the media.

either gays blamed the scientists to support anti-homosexuals in their opinion that gays are just failures since birth,
or gays blamed the whole society for thinking that gayness is a mental disorder that can be "cured".

but they were dissatisfied, as always

[Jason Tandro]

Of course Homosexality is a constantly occurring thing. So is any other sexual desire, fetish, perversion, etc. (no disrespect, but that's the best way I could put it). Doesn't mean I have the Dominate Male and Bondage genes, now do I?

And anybody who argues that homosexuality is a lifestyle I have to disagree with. There are gay men who you would never think were gay (my brother comes to mind. Call him "fag" and he'd kick your ass). And there are flamboyant men (metrosexual) like my friend. Behavior varies from person to person. Homosexuality and Heterosexuality are just sexual preferences.

[tay120n64]

Jason Tandro wrote:

Homosexuality and Heterosexuality are just sexual preferences.

Thank you. I swear, I pity the situation that most homosexual people are put in, but sometimes the whole "rights/lifestyle" thing pisses me off more than feminism.