General McChrystal

[Jason Tandro]

Valerie Valens wrote:

How are soldiers any different from any other people? The millitary is just a job like any other job

No, it isn't. What Freedan and psychokind said.

In a civilian environment if a subordinate wants to questions the orders of their superiors, nothing is at stake except for that individual.

In a warzone, the soldier who doesn't feel like doing his job is the soldier most likely to get his comrades killed.

The argument about "it being all about authoritarian dictatorship" does have some valid leanings in a civilian environment, but you will not find a military in the world that does not operate under the same basic rules of command.

And in MANY countries, they are worse.

In Turkey, for instance, my father saw a sentry get shot in the head by his commanding officer for falling asleep on the job.

[psychokind]

Jason Tandro wrote:

And in MANY countries, they are worse. In Turkey, for instance, my father saw a sentry get shot in the head by his commanding officer for falling asleep on the job.

haha oh wow, that's some hair-raiser from ages ago you won't find that in turkey anymore

anyways, to use the argument the other way round: if countries like germany, where you have oh-my-gawd-don't-forget-propaganda-from-WW2-freedom of speech, you have these power of order.

I am a public official, and even I underlie something similar. I have to act according to laws, and if I feel a law is faulty or goes against basic law (or even if it's obviously like that), I still have to act according to it. I can tell my superior, and give responsibility in his hands. he can then either order me to act anyways, or to report it to the appropriate legislative. or both.

[tay120n64]

Freedan wrote:

Valerie Valens wrote: How are soldiers any different from any other people? The millitary is just a job like any other job, ........... Saying that dissidence and insubordination should not be tolerated is an authoritarian viewpoint that paves the way towards a dictatorship. Just like how any person should be free to criticize one another, and just like how their positions should not matter in that regard, authority should always be questioned lest they become complacent and abusive. that's just the rules they've agreed to serve under.

This is kind of the important part. If you sign up for it, you have no right to complain.

[psychokind]

tay120n64 wrote:

Freedan wrote: Valerie Valens wrote: How are soldiers any different from any other people? The millitary is just a job like any other job, ........... Saying that dissidence and insubordination should not be tolerated is an authoritarian viewpoint that paves the way towards a dictatorship. Just like how any person should be free to criticize one another, and just like how their positions should not matter in that regard, authority should always be questioned lest they become complacent and abusive. that's just the rules they've agreed to serve under. This is kind of the important part. If you sign up for it, you have no right to complain.

absolutely not! never confuse these 2 very different things!

it is against our basic understanding of democracy to say "if you agree, you're at fault". therefore we all have our constitutions/basic laws, which protect the commoners from things like that.

the important part is the other part