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Miss Prime Blue
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Miss Prime Blue Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:44 am Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | And it's smacks of hypocrisy. You can freely talk about being gay and but if you say that homosexuality is immoral you are bashed upon and sued. Eff this so hard, as you say. |
I think that's because discrimination is illegal, and regardless of what your moral stance on someone else's sexual orientation may be, it's easier to prove a discrimination based on this case. _________________ Whenever there's light, there are shadows.
People live on because they forget about unpleasant things. |
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Jason Tandro
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Jason Tandro Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:19 am Post subject: |
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Miss Prime Blue wrote: | Jason Tandro wrote: | And it's smacks of hypocrisy. You can freely talk about being gay and but if you say that homosexuality is immoral you are bashed upon and sued. Eff this so hard, as you say. |
I think that's because discrimination is illegal, and regardless of what your moral stance on someone else's sexual orientation may be, it's easier to prove a discrimination based on this case. |
Discrimination means blocking rights or preventing services based on an opinion, not expressing that opinion. _________________ Support me on Patreon!
Rest in peace, old avatar. |
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Miss Prime Blue
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Miss Prime Blue Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:03 am Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | Miss Prime Blue wrote: | Jason Tandro wrote: | And it's smacks of hypocrisy. You can freely talk about being gay and but if you say that homosexuality is immoral you are bashed upon and sued. Eff this so hard, as you say. |
I think that's because discrimination is illegal, and regardless of what your moral stance on someone else's sexual orientation may be, it's easier to prove a discrimination based on this case. |
Discrimination means blocking rights or preventing services based on an opinion, not expressing that opinion. |
True, but usually people are still going to have a problem with people expressing an opinion that they don't agree with. _________________ Whenever there's light, there are shadows.
People live on because they forget about unpleasant things. |
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psychokind
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psychokind Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:58 am Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | Officials cannot damage the reputation of the office in which they hold? Then how in the hell have we had presidents like Bush and Obama?
Sure officials are generally discouraged from making disparaging comments about their office, and soldiers cannot speak ill of their commander, but at the end of the day these acute policies mean very little in a world which is rapidly considering any kind of standard an infringement of freedom. |
it means very much at the end of the day. because the end of the day will always tell, if the superiors think the statement was ok or not. and this is something that happens all the time, mostly in little scale. and most officials know what they are allowed to say and what not
@miss: discrimination is another perfect example for everyday censorship. and a good one for necessary censorship (much better than youth protection, which most people come up with ) _________________
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Jason Tandro
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Jason Tandro Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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Youth don't need protection from society on an codified level. I think the decisions should be solely on the parental level.
I don't buy into this "right not to be offended" crap. Sadly, though, so many people think that it's MORE important than the freedom of speech. _________________ Support me on Patreon!
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psychokind
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psychokind Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | Youth don't need protection from society on an codified level. I think the decisions should be solely on the parental level.
I don't buy into this "right not to be offended" crap. Sadly, though, so many people think that it's MORE important than the freedom of speech. |
discrimination is more than just a restriction of the freedom of speech. it's mostly a rule that applies to the state and collectives from top-down to not base their decisions on discriminating facts.
example (condition: the majority of black people drive in stolen cars, obese people demonstrably lose weight if they aren't allowed to drive)
"I want a drivers license"
- "well, the state decided to not let obese and black people drive cars. obese should walk to get less fat, and black people tend to steal the cars they are driving in."
"that's just discriminating! just because it has a good effect it's not ok to punish the individual. judge?"
judge: "well, you're right. the state may not discriminate people (exceptions reserved). also, I'm next in line." _________________
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Jason Tandro
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psychokind
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psychokind Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | I'm aware of that, but nobody ever got hurt by some idiot TALKING. ACTIONS are what matter. |
hmm, hitler? or maybe people losing all their money because of some people talking sth about the wall street? _________________
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Jason Tandro
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Jason Tandro Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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psychokind wrote: | Jason Tandro wrote: | I'm aware of that, but nobody ever got hurt by some idiot TALKING. ACTIONS are what matter. |
hmm, hitler? or maybe people losing all their money because of some people talking sth about the wall street? |
Yeah, Mein Kampf didn't slaughter millions of Jews. Hitler's Final Solution did. _________________ Support me on Patreon!
Rest in peace, old avatar. |
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psychokind
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psychokind Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | psychokind wrote: | Jason Tandro wrote: | I'm aware of that, but nobody ever got hurt by some idiot TALKING. ACTIONS are what matter. |
hmm, hitler? or maybe people losing all their money because of some people talking sth about the wall street? |
Yeah, Mein Kampf didn't slaughter millions of Jews. Hitler's Final Solution did. |
all right, despite every documentary stating hitler being the perfect example for the might of sheer speech and propaganda, let's assume his final solution did. his final solution were his spoken words, he didn't even had to make the draft bill himself, because nothing more than his word was necessary. and let's say this has nothing to do with somebody ever got hurt by some idiot talking...
then just take the example with market vacillations caused by rumors, by all means _________________
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tay120n64
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tay120n64 Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | I'm aware of that, but nobody ever got hurt by some idiot TALKING. ACTIONS are what matter. |
You are really going to tell me that your feelings have never been hurt by the words of another?
@MPB: Also, discrimination, in the means we are speaking of at least, is not illegal as far as I am aware. You can get in a lot of trouble for it, but that's just because people don't like to hear things that offend them, which goes back to what Jason had said about our world, "rapidly considering any kind of standard an infringement of freedom." _________________
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Miss Prime Blue
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Miss Prime Blue Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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Words can hurt just as much, or more than any physical action, this is clear and obvious. _________________ Whenever there's light, there are shadows.
People live on because they forget about unpleasant things. |
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Jason Tandro
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Jason Tandro Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:21 am Post subject: |
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@tay/MPB: Yes, words can hurt. For two seconds. Then we get over it. Actions have LASTING consequences. I don't care if you get upset about somebody's opinion of you, deal with it, it's a part of life. As long as your freedoms aren't restricted or you aren't harmed, then you'll be fine.
@psychokind: Yeah, and that all TOTALLY would have happened if he wasn't made the DICTATOR of Germany and given the POWER to DO whatever he wanted.
You know what's interesting psychokind? A lot of Hitler's generals didn't like the idea of the Holocaust; it detracted from their military resources. _________________ Support me on Patreon!
Rest in peace, old avatar. |
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Miss Prime Blue
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Miss Prime Blue Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:24 am Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | @tay/MPB: Yes, words can hurt. For two seconds. Then we get over it. Actions have LASTING consequences. I don't care if you get upset about somebody's opinion of you, deal with it, it's a part of life. As long as your freedoms aren't restricted or you aren't harmed, then you'll be fine.
@psychokind: Yeah, and that all TOTALLY would have happened if he wasn't made the DICTATOR of Germany and given the POWER to DO whatever he wanted.
You know what's interesting psychokind? A lot of Hitler's generals didn't like the idea of the Holocaust; it detracted from their military resources. |
Well yes ... but words don't hurt "for two seconds" for everyone, everyone's different, you know.
And not everyone "gets over it", which is why we have gay kids who are tired of being bullied and abused and commit suicide. _________________ Whenever there's light, there are shadows.
People live on because they forget about unpleasant things. |
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tay120n64
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tay120n64 Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:37 am Post subject: |
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Jason Tandro wrote: | @tay/MPB: Yes, words can hurt. For two seconds. Then we get over it. |
Well. I do. And clearly YOU do. But do most people? Sadly, no.
Psychological pain is far more damaging than physical, dude. I mean, yeah, I realize that most people are frickin' pansies and should quit whining because of a little offensive speech, but there are situations of genuine malicious intent that can permanently damage an individuals psyche, especially when these sorts of scenarios continue.
Don't forget that there are situations when people are genuinely hurt by words. _________________
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